The Five Pillars of Intentional Parenting

What happens when the expectations placed on schools extend far beyond reading, writing, and arithmetic? Dr. Shelley Jones-Holt discovered the answer through her journey from teacher to superintendent, witnessing firsthand how family dynamics shape educational outcomes. Now, as the architect of a revolutionary framework for family leadership, she's empowering parents to reclaim their crucial role in raising successful, well-adjusted children.

At the heart of Dr. Shelley's approach are the Five Pillars of Courageous Family Leadership: personal leadership (knowing yourself), relational leadership (interacting effectively with others), financial leadership (managing money beyond just spending), home leadership (organizing your household), and professional career leadership (the only pillar where schools should bear primary responsibility). This comprehensive framework provides families with a clear roadmap for intentional parenting that many have never encountered before.

What makes her perspective particularly powerful is her unapologetic focus on serving Black families. Using the "curb cut effect" principle—designing solutions for those facing the greatest challenges creates benefits for everyone—Dr. Shelley developed a framework that's universally applicable while addressing specific needs in communities that have experienced generational difficulties. The mother of eight shares practical wisdom about scheduling individual "dates" with each child, creating family organizational systems, and finding liberation in your forties by releasing perfectionism and prioritizing what truly matters.

Throughout this candid conversation, Dr. Shelley balances profound insights with refreshing humor, especially when discussing the changes women face in their forties ("When—not if—you start to lose your mind during menopause, you're going to want that schedule!"). Her approach to family leadership is both structured and deeply compassionate, recognizing that while none of us received formal training in parenting or self-actualization, we can still excel at both with the right guidance.

Ready to transform your family leadership journey? Visit familylegacy5.com to join Dr. Shelley's upcoming webinar and discover how intentional family leadership can change everything from household harmony to your children's future success.

Chapters

• 0:03 Meet Dr. Shelley Jones-Holt
• 8:16 The Five Pillars of Family Leadership
• 17:29 Organizing a Household of Eight
• 21:51 Creating Intentional Family Time
• 31:42 Finding Freedom in Your Forties
• 40:09 Soft Skills and Life Lessons
• 45:10 Vitamins, Priorities, and Scheduling Life

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:03

Hi, I'm Carlene and this is Diva. Tonight I have a special guest with me. She is wow, she has many titles Dr Shelley Jones-Halt. She's a doctor in education. She's a leadership speaker. She also has a family business, which is something I think we definitely have to dig into, which is your leadership legacy consulting, I guess, agency. In a way, like you help families right With what you do.

Speaker 2: 0:36

Carleen, it's an honor to be here and I'm glad you found me and that we could be on the Divas show. So what I do is I started out as a teacher I know we were just talking in the preamble show around being teachers and having that gift of wanting to give back and recognizing that I had a special talent in being able to help people other than myself understand information. I could take very complex information and make it so that people can learn it and understand it, which is essentially the role of a teacher. And then I elevated into leadership and as I traveled that leadership journey from teacher to assistant principal, principal director, all the way to superintendent, as I traveled that journey, what I learned is a lot about myself and my own leadership capacities and capabilities and what I did and did not like to do. But I also learned a lot about families, and not only in starting my own, but in you know the result of your family. Leadership shows up at the schoolhouse every day how you run your household. As much as you might think you keep it at home, trust and believe it comes to school with your kids every single day. And what I found over the years is that, not that my family is perfect. Please do not think that I'm saying this. I always have to give that disclaimer. People come and look at my family and be like you got your issues. Yes, I do, I promise you I do.

Speaker 2: 2:00

But what I noticed is there were a lot of people that did not have the right priorities for parenting or didn't understand what their role was as a family leader and where their role stopped and the school's role started, or vice versa. Right, there was almost this mentality like I gave birth to this human being and then, between the ages of zero and about four and a half, I did my part, like they lived, and now I'm going to turn them over to you for all of the cultivation and nurturing that they need until they hit 18. And it's like no, no, no, no, don't work that way. You know, yes, schools have gotten from just the ABCs and the one, two, threes to now feeding the kids, social, emotional support after school care, before school care, clothing, like there's so many different things that we're asking the schools to do. And what I realized after talking to parents is that they weren't sure about their job and it became so clear to me and I was like this is a place where I can help in the nicest way possible to say.

Speaker 2: 2:56

Let's be clear about what the role of a family leader is and how that plays out, and a lot of that I learned and was able to bring to the table because of my role in educational leadership. So that's why I have the nonprofit, which focuses on family leadership and apprenticeship, and entrepreneurship and homeownership and all of these different pieces that make your family run. That many folks in the communities I was working with didn't understand Right. And then you also have this part of my business, which is being the executive leadership coach. I have served as the CEO of several organizations, so I do know how that works, and some of the tips and tricks of the trade, but also some of the characteristics and growth model work to coach others to do the same. So that's who I am, it's what I love to do and I do what I do in honor and in service of Black women, unapologetically. I am Blackity, blackity, black, black, black, and I always will be, and that's, you know who I am.

Speaker 1: 3:53

I think that is one thing that differentiates women in America versus Canada.

Speaker 1: 4:02

We define ourselves as Black, but we're not going to call it out like that.

Speaker 1: 4:05

I think that's a very strong-minded Black female woman that you are and the way you present yourself. You know what I mean, which is important because I'm Black myself and I think the one thing that a lot of families struggle with is how they run the household. And, as someone who lived in a household that was very dysfunctional, coming out from that, it's like I had to learn to parent myself because I didn't have, like, the best parents, and I thought about it the other day, like how long it's taken me to get here and to like get over all the dysfunction, the trauma and everything that was happening as I was growing up and it's not just me. It's like how my mother was probably raised and then her mother. And, like you said, with, what you do with your community is helping families, because it starts in the home, right, and they say it takes a village to raise a child, and I believe it Like if you don't have a strong village to help you, it struggles, like you know, and in many different facets.

Speaker 2: 5:21

You're right, it does. And and I would argue that just as important as having the village is having a roadmap, because here's the thing you got a whole lot of people going in the wrong direction, houston you now you just got a bigger, more people in the problem because you still have a problem. You know what I mean and, and I agree with you, the difference. I used to live in Michigan, which is right next, obviously right next to Canada, and there is a very distinct difference, especially being from where I'm from and why I am so closely attuned with my identity. Part of our work in family leadership is encouraging others to do the same.

Speaker 2: 5:59

I want my folks to talk about and be proud of their heritage, because that's part of the leadership journey and the leadership responsibilities of families is to teach their children what is their heritage, where did we come from, what are our values? Right, but if you are not even getting that at home, at least if you knew that. Hey, this is what personal leadership is. At least if my parents, I can go figure it out myself. And that's where having a structure to what family leadership is can help even our young people who are in situations that you kind of referenced, where you had no control over that, you weren't going to be able to do anything about that, and it may not have elevated to the level where the authorities quote unquote need to get involved. And so you're in this strange position where you're not necessarily getting what you need emotionally, spiritually, you know, possibly sometimes physically, but it's not to such an extent where you have options of where you can go.

Speaker 2: 6:57

And so what other recourse do we have other than the power of the, not just the village, but education, and an educated village that knows this is what she's going to get at school, and I can be assured that this is what's going to happen, and this is what I am responsible for at home. And you know, I saw something today I haven't fact-checked it, because I saw it literally as I was at a stoplight a little bit before we had this meeting no way, oh my gosh. But I saw an executive order from our amazing, you know, new administration that say now they're going to give people permission to whoop the kids in school again. Wow, and which kind of made me go again. I have not fact checked this, please don't get on there.

Speaker 2: 7:44

I'm telling you right now I happen to see it at a stoplight. We're on a call and it's bringing this to mind, but the reason it's bringing it to mind is if you still believe that the school's job is to teach your child how to behave and to deal with whatever behaviors that your child brings. I mean, they're trying to tell us in the strongest way possible that's not the school's job, and if that thing is real that I saw today at the stoplight what it basically means is there's a whole body of work that we as families need to do, and our children need to know what that work is. And so that's what we talk about is the five parts to family leadership. Everybody has to do their part in our five. That's personal leadership, knowing who you are. Relational leadership Everybody has to do their part in our five. That's personal leadership, knowing who you are.

Speaker 2: 8:27

Relational leadership, knowing how to deal with others right, because that's important. You also have financial leadership. You need to know how to do something with that money besides spending. Spending is one part of the four-part equation of spend, budget, invest and save right. And then you have home leadership how to turn a house into a home. That's an actual skill, like having chore charts and you know knowing when to turn, you know change the air filters and who's going to do the dishes and who's cooking, like those are all things you need to organize and have some leadership of. And then, finally, there is school, which is the professional career leadership. That's the only thing the school is supposed to help you with.

Speaker 2: 9:09

Yet, you know, if I were to put that on my thumb, people are trying to hitchhike their way through life on school, what the school is supposed to do. But it's like, wait a minute. All these other four are the responsibilities of the home and we're, at a certain extent, as an administrator in the schools. I would hear our teachers and their frustration and I feel them. And, on the one hand, there's a well, you shouldn't think like that because that's considered, you know, you don't understand what they're going through and our job is to teach and that is one. Yes, that is true.

Speaker 2: 9:40

But there is also a side of this where it's like, well, is there some merit to what they're saying, in that they can only do their jobs best when these other pieces that are the responsibility of the home are taken care of? And if nobody's talking about what that is if no one's sharing with our families and we can't even agree on what those things are in a general sense, because, notice, I didn't say what religion you had to be in. I didn't say you know what your sexuality? I didn't say anything about that race, nothing. This is just basics of running, of being a human being right and being able to lead yourself.

Speaker 2: 10:16

If nobody is talking about that, then no wonder we're so confused, no wonder there's so much, so many challenges and, as the div, we really got to think about how are we going to take this bull by the horns and go ahead and whip it into shape, because otherwise we're going to keep losing our kids, losing our households, and doing what? Waiting on the government to fix it. Good luck, right? Oh, you wait for superman or superwoman? Well, okay, let me know how that works out. It's you boo.

Speaker 1: 10:44

You've got to do it, yeah, yeah, it's that thing where you got to take care of you first before anybody else like, and even if it's your family and we're talking about family how to run a household properly and education how I guess they run hand in hand, but I think you obviously have to educate your children at home. But before we get any further with that, I am talking to you, so I think we need to figure out more about you and what you do and how you got here. Right, there's more to Shelly than the organization. I mean, obviously, kudos to you for creating this environment. This is amazing, I think it's so. It's so, it's organized. You are very passionate about helping others and making sure that things are done in a certain way to help. You know, like you said, black women, black families, and we always need more help in that way Cause, like every, a lot of minority groups struggle, but we, I think, we struggle a lot more even yes, we do so.

Speaker 2: 12:06

And let me be clear about why I made, I formulated this whole ideology around black families.

Speaker 2: 12:13

And there's a concept known as the curb cut effect, and what the curb cut effect is. It's this idea that if you're trying to solve a problem, you want to begin to create solutions for where the problem is at its worst, right. So here's the idea where the where it came from is. Back in the 70s Many folks don't know that here in the United States we did not have you know how you walk down the sidewalk and you have those curb, those cuts in the curb, that where you can like, where cars can come in, or you know, even on the sidewalk, if you're walking and it goes down like. That wasn't always the case. That was actually something that had to be fought for. Um, it came up as uh, through the americans with disabilities act, where people with wheelchairs were saying, hey, we can't even go down like walk and I and I'm using air quotes down the street because there's nowhere for us to keep going. We have to go around and do all this stuff. And so the city of Berkeley was, like you know what that sounds like a huge problem. Let's consider we're asking for you to cut the curbs in such a way where we can walk wheelchairs up, and it was a huge issue, most likely related to most of it related to funding, because now they were going to have to, like, cut all these curbs and you know that was going to cost taxpayers money. But here's the idea behind the curb cut effect. Yes, it was designed and created for people with wheelchairs, but by designing it and creating it for people with wheelchairs, there are several, many other groups that benefited. Imagine people that were walking with baby strollers, anybody that's delivering groceries or supplies, or delivery trucks that have to pick those dollies up. You have people that were blind that now could tell where things ended, and now they have the bumps on them where they've added that on. And so you have all of these different tangential impacts that were really good from that, from the cutting the curb. But cutting the curb was designed for people with wheelchairs.

Speaker 2: 14:15

So where am I going with this? Come back to the issue of why I designed my program around African-Americans and African-American families. Well, I had the choice of looking at, possibly, japanese families, based on the Japanese internment camps and what had happened over the years and how the Japanese community had to revive itself. From there I'm looking at various other immigrant groups, from, you know, jewish groups to Afghan groups, to Armenian groups. Like I had all these different groups that I could have looked at, and what it came down to was looking at how much and how long the families of a certain group had been impacted, and where did we see the worst impacts.

Speaker 2: 14:58

And no matter what I looked at as far as the research and I know I get really nerdy, this is part of me, is a nerdy research woman, right, but part of what I wanted to do, I mean, there was a part of me that I had this gut you know, cardiac assessment, if you will that I think Black American families are going to be the ones I need to focus on the most. But let me go look and make sure because I don't want to, you know, inadvertently imply or apply the curb cut effect where it doesn't work or where it's not best applied. There is no other group that has suffered more direct impact, more direct targeting for negative consequences, if you will, for negativity, than African-Americans in this country. And so it just made sense. So we just started looking at, well, what are some of the areas where we have the biggest issues? So we put all of that out there and then I wanted to see all the air like just big categories, because, in order to make something applicable to all, yes, you focus on that group as the one with the issues and you want to point out all the issues. Then we categorize them so that we can basically talk about these larger categories, and the larger categories are applicable to most, whereas the individual things are only applicable to that group.

Speaker 2: 16:25

And so, using the curb cut effect as the basis, I was able to look and say, all right, let's pick the group that has the most impact on their families and their family dynamics and have had the most negative consequences as a result, and they're in the worst position, if you will, as a result of all this. And African-Americans came up. And then, when I looked at this internationally whether it was Germany, canada, mexico there was definitely a. If you look at wealth numbers by hue of ethnicity, and so you notice that the darker the hue, the lower the amount of wealth for that group, and so that's where I was able to do it for countries like Italy or England, or places where it's a little bit bigger and it's a little bit more homogeneous.

Speaker 2: 17:19

And so when I looked at all that and came up with it, I realized that you know what my whole goal in life from my upbringing, from my parents, from anything else has always been wanting to help and to serve and to do something, create something that can help people be better people. Can we people better, please, and is there any way I can do to help? And when I realized that all this learning that I've been doing all these years and I love to learn, I love like it's just, it feeds me. I love to learn and so all this learning I could now you know degrees from some very prestigious universities around leadership, and now I can apply that to something that was very near and dear to my heart, like the family and whoa, like that just we talked earlier in the pre-show about like finally feeling like I have something that gives me purpose because, even though I've led organizations, even though I'm a mom of eight, um, I have a wife of eight.

Speaker 1: 18:14

Wow, I mean, I knew you had quite a big family from what I read, but I didn't. Oh my goodness. Wow, how are you here right now? How is she here?

Speaker 2: 18:26

and yeah, oh my gosh, they are literally over in the house waiting on, they're literally waiting to be finished. Yeah, so they're like oh, mom, you're making meatloaf, right? So? Yes, go squish the meatloaf, then I'll be back over here to do smart work right.

Speaker 1: 18:43

So the show, this series that I'm working on is called this, is 40. And I'm talking to women in their 40s. Are you in that wheelhouse? You know, girl? Yes, I am, I sure am All right. Awesome, awesome, that's great. And you have eight. How do you do it?

Speaker 2: 19:03

First of all, we have to be organized, and this is where the leadership comes in.

Speaker 2: 19:07

My husband and I are partners and I hate to say it and I keep harping on it. We do write things out Like honey. I can't figure out who has this and who has that, who's picking up who, and we have to have things mapped out. And so many families it's like you do this at work, Even if people like the local plumber has a calendar and a schedule. I just want y'all to know. The electrician has a schedule, right. Whatever blue collar job you could think of where you're not thinking that pencil and paper or computers are involved. I promise you they have those things. Yet somehow, some way, we believe we can run our family without having a schedule or something, and so that's how we do it and that's what made me turn a lot of this into a family work.

Speaker 3: 19:56

Diva Tonight Glamour for your ears. This is 40, A Female Perspective.

Speaker 1: 20:03

I'm Carlene and this is Diva Tonight, so we were talking about your family and how, in order to run a household, you have to be organized. You know even the plumber who comes to fix your faucet. You know what I mean. He has a schedule of which houses he's going to go to that day, which is true, you know. I started watching. What's her name? She's like the clutter bug lady. She's so cool. Marie.

Speaker 1: 20:28

Kondo? Yeah, I think so, because she does everything based on, like, the way she organizes people's homes or she helps organize. She's on YouTube and she's the clutter bug Because she calls people yeah. So pretty much there's different. There's the bee the clutter bug, like there's different personalities. Yeah, yeah, I know there's different. There's the bee the clutter bug, like there's different personalities. Yeah, oh, you know. Yeah, so I mean even her, like all these things organizing your pantry. So I'm learning from her too, because, like, I'm organized but I'm scatterbrained, so I have to do certain things too and, like you said, writing things down is crucial, you know like with memory, yeah, having a plan, like you know, one of the things that people ask me, like having eight kids, how do you do it?

Speaker 2: 21:14

And I said, well, one of the things that we do is we schedule three dates a year, if you will, that are individual dates that we have with our kids, each of our kids. So, you know, three times a year. We know that. They know that they're going to get like just us time, and so it'll be a day maybe we'll surprise them and go pick them up. My husband and I would get together and we're like, okay, well, this is AJ's day, all right, great, and we'll grab them and we'll go do go-karts and eat ice cream, and you know, and then we but the hope, the purpose of the, but also to have a conversation with them where we're asking them about their hopes and their dreams and their goals and the things that they feel like they're doing well in, and where we can help them and support them and do better as parents. And it's really a beautiful conversation that over time now we've tried through the program to like codify it so that we can give people like a list of questions and starters to open up that these kinds of conversations and make sure that you plan these moments with your young people so that you know who they are, you know how they've shifted and changed, like my daughter has wanted to be a veterinarian. She's wanted to be. I think she wants to be all these things. She wants to be a chef, a pastry chef of some sort, a veterinarian. What else did she tell me recently? Oh yeah, she's going to make crocks. You know those decorative crocks that people have, with all the bells and whistles and beads and stuff. I mean, she has all of these dreams of what she wants to do, right, but how.

Speaker 2: 22:51

I wouldn't know that if I really didn't take the time to sit and listen to her and I actually write this stuff down. And then when we're looking at, all right, where are we going to do? What lessons are you going to do? What sports are you going to play? What are you interested in? What are you interested in theater?

Speaker 2: 23:06

You went like We've got to talk this out, because if you want to do drama and this kid wants to do tennis and this kid wants, I want everybody to be able to do what they want to do. But I need to be able to know, so I can schedule all of this out and make sure you all get the experiences that you want. And also, if you're into something, I can look it up. But we don't really take that kind of time and I would ask the audience like, think about it in the last month, how much time have you taken with any one of your kids individually to get to know where they are, how they're feeling, what are their hopes, what are their dreams, what's changed, what are they excited about for the summer? And those are the kinds of things that I think help us make the house run, because not only do we have a plan and we have schedules and such, but we also spend intentional time with each of our kids and each other to keep, you know, these leadership tenets at the forefront.

Speaker 1: 24:03

Right. And so with your organization obviously your household you organize it as best as you can. I'm sure you have a planner and everyone has their set chores and that kind of thing just to keep everything going. But how do you help families? Do you have workshops? Because what I see here is that you know, when you were talking earlier about how everything runs together, like parenting and how you work on your finances, and like how everything all in one you know what I mean, like your personal life, your, your financial life, your, your your mental health, like you know they all kind of run together. So I think, yeah, and so it seems like with your organization, you help other families structure their life in an organized way. Pretty much right.

Speaker 2: 25:00

That's pretty much it. So we do. I've done several one day seminars. So I'll have like church groups that'll bring me out, or local city councils will want to do like a family day or a family leadership day for their community, and so they'll bring me out and I'll do my one-day workshop. And what ends up happening is I introduce the concept of family leadership and then they get a little booklet to begin to set goals for their family.

Speaker 2: 25:24

And for some people they're like well, what is this? You know, they're kind of like I'm not sure. But for many others it's like oh my gosh, I've never thought about this, I've never sat here and said, like what are the personal leadership goals that I have for myself, for my own health and well-being? Like we are in our 40s. If somebody's not going through menopause, well, let me tell you a little. We can do a whole another show about what that's going to bring, but all of us are going to go through it.

Speaker 2: 25:52

And let me tell you when you when, not if you start to lose your mind during menopause or pre-menopause you're going to want that schedule, because you're not going to want to talk about it. You're going to want folks to know what the expectations are. You're going to want folks to be able to almost be on autopilot sometimes because you're dealing with your own personal summer or your own personal whatever is going on, because the hormonal changes are huge and part of the reason I'm talking about this on this show is because it shows up for us, especially as women in our 40s, in a very different way when it's not together and then we want to look at everybody else, get upset with everybody else and not always want to look and say, well, did I set this up right? Did I even give people the idea? Did I even introduce the conversation about? Did I even set the expectation? But that's real hard to do when your hormones are absolutely insane and you may not have gotten, you know, your medicine or whatever it is you need.

Speaker 1: 26:53

Oh, my goodness, wow, girl, dr Shelly, I'm like blown away. I think there was a reason we connected because I think, like you said, we are definitely going to have more than one conversation. Even if it's like we are definitely going to have more than one conversation, even if it's like like families, for sure, like it's important to help families, but I think, even like single moms, like how to structure your household on your own, you know what I mean Because, as a black woman, a lot of black women, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 27:22

Yeah, I mean, and that's tough. I love what you're bringing up because you know whether like that's so. That's what I do is. I do workshops with groups that want to bring me out. I also have. We are just launching our online program because I've been really hesitant about doing this stuff online, because I do like that personal connection with folks, especially as you talk about something as intimate and personal as their family. But we are launching our first webinar later this month. Our next month, and I believe May 30th, is the.

Speaker 2: 27:53

It's going to be 30th or May 31st I'd have to ask my assistant to the date but we're going to launch our first webinar, to do this in an online course and so that anybody can come together and we bring together family leaders and when I tell you it is so beautiful to see folks that go, oh my God, I thought I was the only one and you have. You know a couple in Alabama talking to a couple in Washington State, talking to a couple in DC talking to a couple in Michigan, and you know one's Asian, one's a lesbian couple, one's a gay male couple. Some have kids, some don't. And we're all talking about how to be better humans. We're all talking about how to be better family leaders. We're all talking about the love and the struggles and the challenges, not only to love one another, but also sometimes to love ourselves. That is powerful, yeah.

Speaker 1: 28:43

Wow, you are. You're like answering some of my questions. I mean, like, what roles does community play in your life? Obviously, it plays many roles because you're bringing many communities together with your with your workshops.

Speaker 2: 28:57

Right, yeah, that you know, I've always been longing for in being in America. It's that being able to have a community that really does. If it can't look like me, at least it is unapologetically for me, right. And if you have both, that's, you know, absolutely fantastic. And in some of the places and spaces I was in as a leader, I saw beautiful communities.

Speaker 2: 29:29

Like we don't talk much about the Armenian community, and let me just tell you, the Kardashians are not the Armenian community, like let's get that out of our hands, right. But you know, some of our Russian, ukrainian communities I know, right now, that's, you know a thing, but remember, there are people who are actually of Russian and Ukrainian descent. We don't even talk about, you know, those kind of, those folks who have come here, but the community they have with one another is beautiful, and so I've always longed to be able to create something for families, to be able to have real conversations with one another and really get to know one another, and so it plays a huge role in how I can bring people together, but also in how I create community for my kids. I want them to see that people from all walks of life really do just want what's best for their families. We're all going through something and let's not let the outside tell us who we should and should not relate to, love, connect with. I think that we need to keep other you know other people out that business and we decide that for ourselves.

Speaker 2: 30:31

So, yeah, I think community is huge and I would also say, like being in education, when you're in a community with people and their children. I think there is a lot that you know we have to appreciate and love about that, because for someone to allow you into their child's life is one of the greatest honors, and so I've always considered it, you know, an honor and a privilege that parents and community members have considered me, you know, worthy to be able to support their kids as their principal or superintendent, but even now as a family leadership coach and an executive coach and a support for people outside of those spaces.

Speaker 1: 31:15

Wow yeah, community is so important and and you know, you know, now that you're in your forties and you have gotten to this place in your life, how do you feel in your life right now? Like, I mean, we were talking about perimenopause and all those things, but how do you feel at this stage in your life?

Speaker 2: 31:28

I would say, right now I feel a different kind of freedom and I'm on my way to liberation, and what I mean by that is I've taken, I've released the need to fix the things that I now realize I'm not going to fix.

Speaker 2: 31:44

And maybe it was never my thing to fix Right, Like when I was in education, like there was a part of me that wholeheartedly believed that I could almost single-handedly, you know, fix the fact that kids aren't learning at high levels in some of our neediest communities. Like it nearly killed me because that was, I believed in it so deeply. And then I had to realize, Sheva, you can't save the world as much as you would like to Like that's not where God has called you to be. And so let's figure out how we can make this a little bit more manageable. And that led to a lot of stress, trying to be perfect, trying to be this, trying to be that, trying to be the perfect mom, the perfect wife. And I think now, in my forties, I've given up any concept of perfection and I'm like I'm at the it is what it is stage of my life.

Speaker 2: 32:35

Right, yeah yeah, honey, I will say you know I don't want to curse, but I will. Man, I'm in my. You know what it face of life right now and it's so freeing. That's what I mean by the freedom part. I feel like huh, who released that burden.

Speaker 2: 32:54

I don't know why I put that on in the first place. That was stupid. Why did I even do that? So there's a certain freedom of trying to release things I can't control. And I'm on my way to liberation because, now that I've really wrapped my mind around the things I can control, I'm now working on being able to be in a place of financial and mental freedom to be able to do whatever the heck I want, when I want, how I want to do it, with who I want to do it with. And for me, that's my definition of liberation, where I don't have to worry about money. I don't have to worry about money I don't have to worry about you know time I don't have to worry about. If I want to do it, I'll do it. If I don't want to do it, I won't do it, right, that kind of thing. And I'm on my way to that because you know what, what only thing that allows us to do that is having the finances to be able to take care of our lifestyle other than that Right.

Speaker 1: 33:45

Yeah, it's so true. One of my mentors told me that financial freedom, you know that's that's the thing that's so important. You know it. It helps in a lot of ways. So you know that, saying it's like with money, we always people have a hard time talking about money. But yeah, but it is, it is important. You know like you need it to retire, you need it to travel, and if you, if you don't know how to manage it which is like an ongoing thing for even people- in our community because we weren't taught that.

Speaker 1: 34:19

I wasn't taught at home about finances. But the getting back to your original statement of being liberated, I can feel the liberation in your voice, like I'm not in the same room with you but I can hear it. You know what I mean. You can hear when that energy comes across and like, even when you're probably having a bad day, you're still going to try and see the positive side of things. Like you know, we'll try. We'll try, right.

Speaker 2: 34:45

Yeah, I love what you just said around, you know, having the financial literacy to be able to do that and it not being something that we share. But I would also argue that, as women at our age, we need to stop not being comfortable talking about money Like sister to sister, woman to woman, you know, female to female. We need to recognize that we are not going to get better at something we're afraid to talk about. We're not going to understand the rules of the game if we're not even willing to talk about the game. We're not, and so you know I get.

Speaker 2: 35:19

I feel you deeply when you said you know, we were not always taught and we don't talk about it. And so how are we ever supposed to learn, how are we ever supposed to grow, if not only do we not talk about it, but for some reason we've made it taboo, almost insulting and embarrassing to talk about what you don't know. And nothing could be further not liberating and I would say that's one of the pieces of my liberation is that I'm at an age now where, when I tell you I could care less, I don't care if you think the question is stupid, the other person, I don't know what I'm going to ask and I'm going to keep asking until I figure out what it is you're talking about, right and you know, whereas before I might have been. Oh well, they might feel I'm stupid. Well, hell you stupid for thinking I'm stupid. Go and think that stupid. I'm gonna ask my question, right, and you know, I feel like at this age we're like man, whatever, whereas before we might've been more concerned About what people think.

Speaker 1: 36:21

Yeah, yeah, it's true, it's so true. Yes, it is yeah.

Speaker 2: 36:26

I found out about, especially around the stock market. I just started asking people who I thought looked smart questions about. I know it sounds insane, like I'd be at a restaurant somewhere. I'm like, hey, you look like you invest in the stock market, do you? And they'd be like, yeah, I do. As a matter of fact, I realized that Tell me something that I don't know. And they would start talking and I'm like mom, why are you doing that? Looks like you got information that I could use. Why wouldn't I? But I guess that's for me.

Speaker 1: 36:56

You know what it's so true, I think now I think less about what people think, like I've done it too, where I'm in a line, I'm at the Tim Hortons, and I remember this day like it was yesterday. You just made me think of this other person I met when I was out too, and I said I'm like your daughter's hair is so nice. And then you know that started the, started the conversation, and I think so I ordered my coffee, then she went, and then I ran into her again and she's like oh, come and meet my mom, and it turned into this whole other thing just because I said something to her when I was waiting in line at the Tim Hortons.

Speaker 2: 37:28

Like I'm telling you so, like and, yeah, you did, you did good at your people in that day. Yeah, I did right, so Right, so did you. So did you? I'm a big daughter of a lot of people, yeah, but yesterday my husband and I are in Lowe's and we're with my daughter and I'm picking out paint colors. But obviously I'm knee-deep in paint colors and if any of you have ever picked a paint color, you know Like we black, right, and they're all say black of some sort, right? Or you know, take different shades of white, but I want whitey, whitey, white, white. I got ultra white. Anyway, I'm standing there looking at you know the purples at the time and I my husband is standing right next to me so he can see behind me, but I can't, and so I'm staying steadily standing. I nobody's, saying anything, I'm in my own little world. Finally, my husband looks over. He says, hey, you can use your words. Looking at him, like, who are you talking to? Apparently a lady had been standing there trying to get by.

Speaker 2: 38:29

She says, excuse me okay and then my husband goes yes, we can. All people today we're gonna learn to people. Oh my gosh, yeah, you know a good minute. You know just waiting for. I was like, and he's like, I wanted to tell you she gonna be here a while. You see, I'm just marinating like it's gonna take her a minute to choose from the 12 different purples that y'all have given her. So you can stand there if you want to and not say excuse me, or you can use your words.

Speaker 1: 39:01

Oh my gosh, I am actually just envisioning that, because anyone who's listening can relate to that, because we've all been there when, even yesterday, when I went to Walmart and I was packing my stuff and clearly not fast enough and then the girl like the next two girls, they were packing up their stuff and it's like I wasn't even there. I'm like do you not see me? Sometimes I wouldn't even say anything, but I'm like do you not see me here, like I'm not done packing up my stuff, but you're clearly like doing it as if I'm not even there, right, and it's like the whole manners thing, like I'm not even there, right, and it's like the whole manners thing.

Speaker 2: 39:37

Like you can't see me. Yes, yes, I'm going to need you to quit acting like you or like you're so scared to just regular people. Like, let's not let all this divisiveness and crap that's going on in our world Keep us from being regular people. That the hellos. Goodbyes. Thank you, excuse me, hi, how are you have a great day?

Speaker 2: 39:59

Like, those things still work y'all, and they're universal across all identities. Y'all can't see me saying that, but just know I said that with my whole chest. So, like I'm just saying these things still work and I think when we get in our 40s is when we finally look around and go I need y'all, I'm gonna need y'all to stop. Maybe, and maybe that's the auntie age, like, maybe we've. It is where we looking at everybody ready to whoop everybody, kids, even the grown ones, even looking at the grown man, like boy, don't make me, uh-uh, don't make me take off my chancla and go. Don't play with me. Not today, my friend, and tomorrow don't look good either. I'm going to need you to people better. Excuse me is the word you were looking for.

Speaker 1: 40:45

I love that you have to coin the phrase I'm going to need you to people better. If only we could say that you know You're going to have to use your people skills that your parents taught you. Did they teach you you know?

Speaker 2: 40:59

yeah, it's the soft skills and softies. I mean we got them. Come on, I mean maybe it's to the point where we just need to make it a gesture, like we just wiggle our fingers together and be like, okay, soft skills, and we all know like it's just. It becomes like the head nod.

Speaker 1: 41:12

I know what the head nod mean or just that, look you know, yeah, I'm trying to get through. Yeah, yeah, yeah, try to get through. Oh my gosh.

Speaker 2: 41:27

Oh my gosh, she's funny.

Speaker 1: 41:28

Oh, I love it. I love it. This is amazing. Yes, definitely love this conversation and what you bring to the table. So you said you're launching the webinar in May, at the end of next month. So I mean that'll be exciting. I think I will. Depending on what comes with that whole webinar, I might have to consider it. You know, save up my my not pennies anymore, my nickels. You know what I mean so I can join in.

Speaker 2: 41:53

Yeah, well, hopefully, yes, I mean, that's my goal and let me just tell you and everybody else for this first time it's impact and leaving a legacy, and so this is what I want to really refine and be able to leave as my gift to the world, if you will. It's like here's a framework for how to think about this thing called family leadership and if you want and it's just five very clear pillars that you get to define how you want to for your family, but I need you to understand that all of them need to be taken care of and you cannot expect the school, you cannot default any of these responsibilities to the school. If we want to see, you know, real change happen, if we want to see real change happen, if we want to be very proud of what we have produced Because what I often tell people is raising our families and being our best self is the one job that we all have. It's the most important job, yet it's the job we have the least training in, it's the job we have the least support, the least amount of guidance to do.

Speaker 2: 43:21

No one taught me how to be me and no one taught me how to raise these kids, which, honestly, are the two biggest things in my life and I think, coming to this age and for us to realize that there is nobody that can do you better than you, and there is nobody that God gave those kids to other than you and gave that, you know, husband or wife or spouse or whoever it is that's in your family leadership community, that's yours, you are an expert in that and so as much as we can do to be our best at that, you know, it's definitely going to be something that I think all people it's going to be free to attend the webinar. Please, by all means, come hear a little bit more about it. But, most importantly, I would encourage you that if you want to be your best, you, if you're still struggling with some of these things, if you're in your forties and like, look, maybe I haven't gone through menopause or I'm starting to, but what she said about being organized when you get in this bad boy, that hit home in a different way. And I'm hoping to see you there because I'm going to tell you it does hit in a different way. And had I not had some of these structures in place in my family as of right now, entering this honey, I got my vitamin. My bag of vitamins is right here.

Speaker 2: 44:32

Yeah, yeah, I'm a shake.

Speaker 1: 44:33

Oh my gosh, the whole bag of vitamins thing. Have you seen, like tia, from what? There's this thing on instagram for a while back where she was like in her 20s she was like drinking alcohol doing the whole thing, and now in your 40s it's like, okay, you have a fruit table and then all your vitamins, your vitamin d, like. You see her just like yeah, this is for you.

Speaker 2: 45:00

With all your vitamins. Hold on, let me get you here. That's my best of vitamins that I have that I have to keep with me and take every day, and it's everything from the iron to the B12 to the once a day to the like you got to. Yeah, you're right. You know we start out, we drink anything. What's that in that cup? I don't care, I'll drink it. Now we're like hold on, is that organic? Is that alkaline water? Is it what the heck happened to us.

Speaker 1: 45:28

Oh my gosh, dr Shelly, you make me laugh. I love it. That's awesome, awesome. It's an alkaline water. Oh my goodness, how much sugar is in that.

Speaker 2: 45:42

Is it real sugar or is it some of that aspartame stuff? Right, like we now got all these damn questions. Honey, we drank strawberry hill. I'm a DJ to act like that moonshine. I'm a DJ, y'all to act like that moonshine. Thank you so much. Y'all was drinking. There's no beer, toilet water, like if any of y'all went to them Omega parties back in the day and you joined the Omega party.

Speaker 1: 46:07

What is an Omega party? Oh my goodness so.

Speaker 2: 46:10

Omega, psi Phi is one of the fraternities that we have here. It's actually international now, okay. So the Omegas when you're in college you go to these Omegas and any frat party, like any of y'all that went to a frat party, it's a fraternity and they had their special juice, and then the Sigmas had their juice, and then you had the PWI fraternities and sororities would have their things. So my point is any of y'all who went to college and drank anything in any of these places, I'm going to need y'all to hush, because right now we're sitting up here talking about, is it alkaline, filtered water? We drink Fiji water. Oh, that has a little too much. I'm watching my thighs, I don't know. Look at that. Y'all serious right now? But yes, we are.

Speaker 1: 46:59

We have all the vitamins, the hormones, the oils, ointments yeah, I mean like now it's true, though, because it's like I have to take magnesium to help me sleep, all these things are crazy.

Speaker 2: 47:10

I just you had to start with the biofreeze, or in the old day they used to call it the big game. Like but I wake up and put some bio freeze on it because it hurts so bad, like nobody tells us these things. So no, when I wake up and my back hurts, I don't want to think about who's cooking breakfast. That needs to be on the schedule, because if it is not my day, I'm not getting up. That needs to be on the schedule, because if it is not my day, I'm not getting up.

Speaker 1: 47:39

Hey, at least now, like you said, maybe you don't, you, you don't have to get up that day. Right, it's on the schedule. I have to say that I feel like it's one of those moments where you said if it's not on the schedule, it's not happening.

Speaker 2: 47:58

It's not happening. Girl, that is my coin, and so you literally will have kids.

Speaker 2: 48:03

My 17-year-old is the worst at it. He'll go put something on the schedule like 10 minutes before it is. So I had to get him one day. I was taking screenshots of the schedule because he's like mom, I put it on the schedule, like no, you didn't. It was like this is the kind of fun you get to have when you have a tight schedule. Is now it's like oh, so you think they're still going to be teenagers, they're still going to do stupid stuff it's just now not going to be unscheduled which is so great.

Speaker 1: 48:32

Oh my gosh, this conversation has been amazing. But, yes, we will definitely have you on the show again to talk about closer to the date yeah, like even the webinar, and then we'll definitely have to talk about menopause, for sure. There's so much to talk about. You are definitely what do they say? A force to be reckoned with. There we go right.

Speaker 2: 48:53

Yes, well, thank you for having me.

Speaker 1: 48:59

It's been a, a girl. This has been an awesome conversation. This has definitely been a conversation I will not forget and so remind us again. So the name of the organization where you help other families get organized is through the leadership nonprofit is um W.

Speaker 2: 49:17

It's a wwwfamilylegacy5.com. That is our website, familylegacy5.com, and that's for the five pillars of courageous family leadership, which is the name of our introductory online course, and it's just an intro to family leadership, and so if you want to join us for the webinar, please by all means go to the website register. You can also find me on Facebook, on LinkedIn, I believe, we are also on Twitter, not Twitter, instagram and if all else fails, just come on over to the website, send me a message and yes, you may just get me replying to come and have a conversation about how we can best serve you, your organization, your community and help just help us all be more intentional about our family leadership, where we live, where we learn.

Speaker 1: 50:10

Definitely. Thank you again, Dr Shelly Jones-Holt.

Speaker 3: 50:15

Diva Tonight with Carlene will be back. Send us a message on Instagram at diva underscore tonight.